Goldman Sachs Summer Internship

oh, another goldman sachs thread :)
i guess you just need to be patient, i assume they have got big volumes of applications ..and it will take some time..

any further updates on your other apps?
has hsbc meanwhile got back with an offer ? if they do, will you take it?

Hazel, Things have calmed down a little bit for me. I guess everything will kick off from January for the Intern applications. Most of the IB recruitment activities are taking place with Standard, Macq, BNP, Societat and some boutiques. I have not applied to any of these; I am a little bit USA/UK-centric lol. In terms of graduate recruitment; I am only waiting to hear from Nomura and MS. Currently being considered by Bailey gifford and Man Group. Internshipwise; I applied to GS, CS, ML-BofA, BARCAP, Citi and Seo-London.

I have already notified HSBC that I have signed my contract with the other bank and will not be pursuing this default/clearing opportunity (so did another one person from my AC). I know atleast two have accepted offer from my AC (one of them chose HSBC over Barcap DCM as HSBC offered three different placements). I have a feeling one of the other offer-holder has declined his/her offer; so there may be one more AC on the 17th with a recruitment possibility of 12.5% for one individual.

Goldman usually gets back to the interns in January. Atleast, they have been doing so for the last two years.

Nomura has had Final Rounds (ACs) for IBD and GM - London FT

Thank you for the info IBD_Haunter. Thats a shame about Nomura; I was hoping to be screened (at least). to be honest I rushed my application and cover letter was copied and pasted lol; no wonder I have not heard back. Oh well; lets just hope I can get one of those internships before starting FT employment from September.

Hazelground, I have PMed you. How is your applications going? I also noticed you have been invited to the Citi CMO interview; best of luck.

Thank you for the info IBD_Haunter. Thats a shame about Nomura; I was hoping to be screened (at least). to be honest I rushed my application and cover letter was copied and pasted lol; no wonder I have not heard back. Oh well; lets just hope I can get one of those internships before starting FT employment from September.

Hazelground, I have PMed you. How is your applications going? I also noticed you have been invited to the Citi CMO interview; best of luck.

Connection problem therefore repeated posts; my sincere apologies.

Hey Aj,

well, you're right, i cannot complain about not being invited to ACs at this moment...LOL...but I believe I am being quite unfortunate either to have a clash of interviews for top choices or personal commitments which prevent me from taking part....
i wrote to the HR recruiter from Citi begging for another AC date, so let's see how it goes...

yeah, i have seen your PM, and replied...will write in detail in some time :)

hey hazel,

were you invited to the AC directly, or did you have the first round and then got the AC invite after that? Also, can you PM me about when the AC is? atleast which week?

oh yeah sure....i just did...hope it helps...but as i wrote, i did not book the AC after all...
not sure whether i will get another date...

there will be more dates for sure!

yes, hopefully. I wrote to the recruiter and asked. If I find out something, will let you know...

cheers

@ Aj

just realised that taking a summer internship can be tricky for final year students of recent graduates - does this imply that you need to cancel all your current jobs if you plan to accept an internship offer? Also, if you get a full-time offer, it will be for the next year...so, if we must cancel our current offers, we need to search for other jobs to fill the waiting time....is it so? I'm getting confused...

hmm.. that's an interesting question hazel. I am curious myself. can anyone shed any light on this?

@Hazelground

If you already arrange an internship, that will be probably OK.

However, if you try to get an intern for summer and a full time for September within the same sector. Then, it will not be good and never try that. Let's say that you have a full-time offer and you decided to accept it. Then what you should do is withdrawing internship applications.

oh really?
that does not sound too good...what if my full time offer starts next september and I have free time over the summer..why cannot I do an internship with another bank?

is this actually forbidden? Can someone share their own experience?

Hazel,

Few of the banks do not specify the penultimate year requirements for internships and the ones who do; they accept the notion of doing Masters.

Personally; my full time offer starts from 6th September; so I am completely eligible to take up any other employment. One of my university friends did an internship with Barcap-IBD before starting with his Grad trading role from Sept-2009 with Deutsche. I also spoke with HR and they told me before 6th of September; I am free to do what I please. I also believe most of the Summer internships for 2010 will end by 3rd September;which makes it very convenient.

It is not formally forbidden but they don't like it. If you don't inform them about the intern, they can even renege your contract.(extreme case) .If you have such a situation, then you should definitely inform the company!

Think it like :

You will marry on September and you are thinking to go to holiday with another girl you like. So the girl whom you will marry with will not like it !

If you already have a full-time offer, then bank will think there is no benefit for the bank(intern bank), because you have already accepted a contract. They can not hire you. They will not train you for their competitor.

In addition, why someone wants to make an intern, to get a professional experience before to get a full-time position which will help during his job hunt and you can shape your interest bla blabla. People will think that you are too much greedy !

@AJ

One of my friend had the same problem last year and he was on the edge of loosing his full-time offer. He saved his ass by withdrawing the intern contract.

oh well, things are really tricky!
but is it mandatory to inform your bank (full-time offer one) in advance that you will take up an internship elsewhere?
C'mon, that's too much to expect....they can fire people at the drop of a hat, and we are supposed to report back every time something happens?> that's annoying!

Solomon, thank you for your posts. I am still going to try with the intenships and if I do end up with an offer I will discuss this with you later. I guess: one will always learn from his/her own mistake more than from someone else's mistake/advice. Lets just hope I don't make any grave errors.

Aj

@Aj,

I guess I will follow the same approach too ----
but I would be probably more cautious about things :)

anyone else wants to share their intentions???

@Aj and @Hazel

Of course you can try to find an intern before full-time however I wanted to show you the extreme situations. Hopefully, everything will be fine hehehehe

By the way, you guys lucky that you start on September. I will start on early August so I can not attend an intern program LoL

Best,

@Aj and @hazel

What are you guys saying to intern-app banks about your plans for next year? Masters/gap year?

Also what is your motivation for working over the summer? Are you applying for a different role? I understand why you might want to - its scary commiting to the first couple of years of your career. In any case, I admire your determination in doing more apps - I've definitely run out of energy in this recruitment cycle hehe.

@NEalKoblitz

LOL....good question...i have not thought of it as of now since I have not attended an AC for a summer internship...
but if I get the one for Citi, i will start to think of something :)

Neal, I am on the same boat as Hazel. To be honest I have not faced that question yet regarding Masters but I will manipulate information as required (if that makes sense). My internship applications are based on the recommendations from my friends who work for those banks. One from GS suggested I apply to Securities and I did; same with Deutsche; however, one from ML-BofA suggested I apply for Sales but I applied for IBD instead. HSBC's DCM group is hot in EMEA; so you do not need to worry any more... Just enjoy yourself for the next few months and get ready for HSBC.

I like Solomons comparison about holiday girl and marriage girl.... LOL.

me too.... a good one!

very sexy example :-))

Any update on the internship applications/interviews?

Heard securities started interviews for summer interns. Also internal audit.

Hey Aj,

I applied for summer associate, never heard anything back yet.

nada, zip, I think not even a confirmation email

I guess only the best of the best get to interview at GS, 99% need not apply. tough,
maybe one day I will hire GS for my IPO..

i also applied for summer internship for research in global markets. and still no response. just "under review".
guys i have a question. which banks did you apply for more than GS?

CS, BoA, DB, UBS (messed up my numerical big time attempting it over christmas break at 1 am), Rothschild, Citi, MS

only did online test for DB and CS, never heard back from anyone else. Applied for summer internships..

I am not from targetted school, wont be surprise if they dont even bother rejecting me.

definition of targeted school is controversiol i think so. i am not studying in lse or warwick. but goldman came to my campus with a VP and HR expert in ankara, turkey. should i believe i am lucky or desperate?

Well then you may be lucky, trust me luck plays a crucial role. Just apply you never know..

I used to think I create my own luck. *

Having been on the HR side where I have to decide and hire 1 person with 30 CVs on my table and more coming in every hour flooding my inbox. I am ashamed to say the following. I do not look at all of them. In fact most times, it is not the best qualified person who gets the job.

It is the person whom I deem would be easiest the work with, would not demand too much, who have a concise CV, who sound good on the phone. In fact, those who actually picked up the phone when I call them. I have a pile of work to do, I ain't calling you back if you can't be there to pick up my call.

I know it sounds harsh but I, like many other recruitment consultant become desensitise. When I started, I made the effort to go through every CV and rejected everyone with a personal email and feed back (I swear). I felt very bad for each rejection I sent. eventually I got sick of idiots who applied for the sake of applying. They even ask me to explain the job when I call and tell them my company name because they cannot be bothered to make a note. I do not appreciate my time being wasted and these applicants make it hard for those genuine ones. So I develop a coping strategy.

So I totally understand how its like when someone has to look through my CV with 100 or 1000s others whilst having deadlines to meet.

I have looked through 100s of CVs and hired many people, I think there was only 1 occasion where I actually hired the MOST qualified person.

You may think I know what to write to attract recruiters, yes but luck.. plays a crucial role.

Luck is when preparation meets opportunity.

Yes, if you are an outstanding candidate of course you will get selected, what if there are 100 outstanding candidates for 5 spots? that is what I am referring to.

To add to that post, I also use assessments to help me recruit.

Out of say 50 applications, I decide to send out maybe 20 asssesment. coz each of them cost me money!

Of the 20 assessment not all of them would bother doing it. Trust me! Of the 20 I am sure I have included those who are applying for the sake of applying and probably missed the best person.

about 5 of the people will screw up the assesssment, a few others will open and close it. I am left with those that actually showed commitment those who email me, asking about their result after the assessment. Which I may add are often not the ones who score the highest. They are also not the one whom I thought would do well based on their CVs. Those that I hope would do well simply didn't bother or scored low on the assessment for whatever silly reason. I am left with the survivors. :)

tough luck for me and tough luck for the applicants.

Dangerousrave are you saying that as a recruiter you preferred those people who emailed/called after assessments to chase up their results/feedback? Having spoken with some recruiters in the past I have found the opposite, in that being chased just annoyed them, they were going to get back to everyone in due course anyway so didn't need people to ask and just found it wasted their time

No and yes

Personally I would say I do not like being chased up. But because of the nature of the recruitment process - it is really a mating game. I somehow always end up with those people who incidently chased me up. Despite me secretly prefering someone else. Which I suspect those that I prefer are probably being chased by other firms as well so they are the choosers, not me.

It is different if say the firm you are after is a big firm and the head of HR herself (mostly ladies), has to protect the image of the firm she works for. Where as I do not have to worry about that.

I think an advise was thrown out earlier somewhere in this forum, and I would reiterate that. If they have started recruitment for that division, and you haven't heard back when others have been called up 90% of the time you are not selected. Keep looking.

It is human psyche, if i have mentally cross you off my list, for me to call you back up because I couldnt contact my targetted one - It means I have made a mistake in my judgement earlier. Even if I really did (which I know I did, people in general just don't bother) I find myself continue looking through new applications rather than going back through old ones to look for gems there. If you know what I mean? I am only human, I make snap judgements and I know I am wrong and I can admit it. I can't speak for the rest.

It pains me to say this but - I guess the recruitment process is flawed, I do not for a moment believe the process of recruitment currently employed by most firms is any better than the exam process universities use to identify winners in life. Nevertheless it is still the best we've got.

So really if to score well in exams and uni , is about exam technique. The same thing goes for job application, it really is a matter of practice. Check all the boxes and with a bit of luck the questions u prepared for comes up in the exam/interview

I noticed some negative comments/rating earlier, I cannot speak for the recuirtment process in IBs as that is not my field.

But what is said is the sad truth. Othe recruiters won't admit it but I do and I will speak up. I have nothing to gain from saying things like that here and everything to lose.

If you ever applied for a job which I am sure all of us here have, and never got a reply. You will know what I mean.

I am not trying to paint a gloomy picture. I am just stating the facts so we can take it into consideration and use it to your advantage. The playing field is never level, it is like a game, are you gonna play the game or are you gonna complain about the rules?

One disclaimer, you have to understand this, the fact that you are reading this tells me you are well above average compared to the general population in terms of future potential earnings and academic distinction. Otherwise you won't be thinking of applying to IBs. You may be the best candidate by a mile, but if the second best comes to the same interview after you having 'known' what sort of questions are being asked and already prepared a polished scripted answer, pratice it in front of a soap box and mirror a hundred times. I don't care who the recruiter is, the recruiter will be swayed.

The recruitment I deal with is not that selective. It is more for clerical jobs, marketing people, admin staff. So my earlier comments may not be appropriate

i appreciate the honest and you have just reinforced all the things I already suspected and in some cases knew. It a tough world out there particularly those looking for first time employment and the sector we have chosen is just about the toughest!

tr226, you are right.

lets not forget the other thousands of first year city analyst or even associates who got the chop due to the crisis and some of which have rejoined the pool of applicants.

Success stories are proned to something called survivorship biased. You only hear about 'winners.' Without a clear picture of total number of applicants to you have a biased view.

Being a recruiter, I get 30 applications within hours when I put out an ad for a project based job - not days not weeks BUT hours! My inbox gets filled up when I answer a few phone calls - I see those applications coming in REAL time. I dont even think there is any difference now between FT/PT or project based. Demand for jobs simply outstrip supply !

Put yourself in their shoes, are you going to spend 2 full days reading all CVs and cover letter to place one temp guy? You have another 10 vacancy to cover before the end of the day. That is another 200 -300 CVs and cover letters. What would you do?

I kid you not I really did read thorough every one, wrote feedback and commented and called each and every one personally, when I started. Becasue that is the way I would like to be treated at least have the courtesy to reject me personally. So I did that in the beginning. Guess what? I only have 24 hours a day! It is simply not humanly possible.

Those that don't pass the assessment don't even get looked at now.

What I tend to do is I pick a select few and scrutinise them real hard. Due diligence and reference must add up!

I appreciate the position recruiters are in, I'm just hoping that my CV is one of those few somebody at a company somewhere takes a look at! Luckily I managed to find a few smaller firms who seem to be off the radar of most graduates as they don't advertise their jobs on milkround etc and have now got interviews lined up there as I was having no success with the big firms which i suspect was partly down to the problems you have highlighted.

For example I applied to fidelity and when I didn't get a reply to my application when I knew others had been contacted I emailed recruitment to ask about the state of my app. I was told if i hadn't been contacted I hadn't got the job as I had expected. When i logged onto their system though my app hadn't even been looked at it was still submitted and never turned to under review, this is despite it being submitted before others who were screened.

Swings and roundabouts I guess just keeping my fingers crossed!

I am in my penn ultimate year of university at the London School of Economics...I submitted my application to GS towards the first week of December and haven't heard anything from them so far :( I'm not a EU citizen and am wondering if that has something to do with the recruitment process or not. This is really nerve racking..I wish i would hear something from them!!!

Someone inside told me they will call me within days (applied for London IBD summer internship). Am waiting since november. Somehow it seems the 'big guys' have an agreement on when they start calling (JPM also told me they will call me end of this week).

ahh.. GS, the creme de la creme of banks, almost mythical status,

man i'd give them 100 hous a week for free!

g'luck guys!

Hi,
Does anyone know what the kind of interview the first stage interview is and maybe what kind of questions will come up for the Securities Summer internship position?

Thanks & Regards

is there anyone who applied to intern position for research department and is contacted? i applied on the last day of application, december 6, and still there is no any response. i begin to think that i am rejected. :( is there anyone to give me some hope :D

@mmkubilay

I do not know what your background is, but I applied on the last few days as well- summer intern, haven't heard back.

Won't be surprised if they do not bother rejecting, I am sure they are swarmed with applications and are very selective for their limited number of spaces. I wont be suprise if the ratio of applicants to openings is somewhere around 100:1

@dangerousrave

i ve graduated from busines administstaion department with unofficial specialization of finance. i also had numerous macroeconomics courses. in addition i am currently followng a financial mathematics masters degree. i have no doubt to be related with the job requirements. but as u mentioned, the competition is tough and i am not a student of oxbridge&lse group. i am studying in a country called as an emerging market.
i hope they let me have a numerical test, since i have no doubt to complete all correct. but what i need first is an opportunity... :(

@mmkubilay

You are not alone buddy, competition is tough I have no doubt you will do great things in life probably even better than those HR dude who rejected you for IB, but that is life, a lot of candidates are equally good too.

Look at it this way there are plenty of candidates who are capable for the job. with top firms getting 5000 to 10000 applications for maybe a 100 places or less? you do the maths buddy. Odds are tough. Plus even if you are from oxbridge you'd probably get rejected unless you have contacts in GS vouching for you. It is almost elitist like Harvard.

I nailed 19 out of 20 for a DB numerical only to be rejected 2 days later. And maths is not even my strength. I spoke to some maths whiz who taught it was freaking easy and completed the test with plenty of time left.

the questions are easy, but under that time pressure and other pressure are the ones that gets to most people.

I think the numerical test is only a tool to separate the cream from the crop.

I know this is gonna sound cliche "the best create their own opportunity" or at least that is how they attribute their success.

http://racing-towards-excellence.com/index.php?w=authors-bios

read about the author a 22 year old working for GS now, wrote a book at 22, awarded 100k worth of scholarships and record 10 A levels.

We are in the same boat, I feel you, good luck. Why not start your own business or something?